Legislature(2021 - 2022)BARNES 124

03/10/2022 08:00 AM House COMMUNITY & REGIONAL AFFAIRS

Note: the audio and video recordings are distinct records and are obtained from different sources. As such there may be key differences between the two. The audio recordings are captured by our records offices as the official record of the meeting and will have more accurate timestamps. Use the icons to switch between them.

Download Mp3. <- Right click and save file as

Audio Topic
08:04:39 AM Start
08:05:10 AM Confirmation Hearing(s): Department of Commerce, Community & Economic Development - Commissioner
09:12:06 AM HB309
10:02:51 AM Adjourn
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ Consideration of Governor’s Appointees: TELECONFERENCED
Department of Commerce, Community, and Economic
Development - Commissioner Julie Sande
-- Public Testimony --
+= HB 309 APOC; CAMPAIGN CONTRIBUTIONS/REPORTING TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSHB 309(CRA) Out of Committee
-- Testimony <Invitation Only> --
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
                    ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
    HOUSE COMMUNITY AND REGIONAL AFFAIRS STANDING COMMITTEE                                                                   
                         March 10, 2022                                                                                         
                           8:04 a.m.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative Sara Hannan, Co-Chair                                                                                            
Representative Calvin Schrage, Co-Chair                                                                                         
Representative Josiah Patkotak, Vice Chair                                                                                      
Representative Harriet Drummond                                                                                                 
Representative Ken McCarty                                                                                                      
Representative Kevin McCabe                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Representative Mike Prax                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CONFIRMATION HEARING(S): DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE~ COMMUNITY &                                                                    
ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - COMMISSIONER                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 309                                                                                                              
"An Act  exempting candidates for municipal  office and municipal                                                               
office holders in  municipalities with a population  of 15,000 or                                                               
less from financial or  business interest reporting requirements;                                                               
relating  to campaign  finance reporting  by certain  groups; and                                                               
providing for an effective date."                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED CSHB 309(CRA) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 309                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: APOC; CAMPAIGN CONTRIBUTIONS/REPORTING                                                                             
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) KREISS-TOMKINS                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
02/07/22       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
02/07/22       (H)       CRA, STA                                                                                               
03/03/22       (H)       CRA AT 8:00 AM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/03/22       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/03/22       (H)       MINUTE(CRA)                                                                                            
03/08/22       (H)       CRA AT 8:00 AM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/08/22       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/08/22       (H)       MINUTE(CRA)                                                                                            
03/10/22       (H)       CRA AT 8:00 AM BARNES 124                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
JULIE SANDE, Appointee, Commissioner Designee                                                                                   
Department of Commerce, Community & Economic Development                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:   Testified as  appointee to the  position of                                                             
commissioner designee of the Department  of Commerce, Community &                                                               
Economic Development.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
NILS ANDREASSEN, Executive Director                                                                                             
Alaska Municipal League                                                                                                         
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified and  responded to questions during                                                             
the hearing on HB 309.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JONATHAN KRIESS-TOMKINS                                                                                          
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  As prime  sponsor, answered questions during                                                             
the hearing on HB 309.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
HEATHER HEBDON, Executive Director                                                                                              
Alaska Public Offices Commission                                                                                                
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:   Responded  to questions during  the hearing                                                             
on HB 309.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:04:39 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR CALVIN  SCHRAGE called the House  Community and Regional                                                             
Affairs  Standing  Committee  meeting   to  order  at  8:04  a.m.                                                               
Representatives  McCarty, Drummond,  McCabe, Hannan,  and Schrage                                                               
were  present at  the  call to  order.   Representative  Patkotak                                                               
arrived as the meeting was in progress.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
^CONFIRMATION  HEARING(S): Department  of  Commerce, Community  &                                                               
Economic Development - Commissioner                                                                                             
  CONFIRMATION HEARING(S): Department of Commerce, Community &                                                              
              Economic Development - Commissioner                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
8:05:10 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  SCHRAGE  announced that  the  first  order of  business                                                               
would be  the confirmation hearing  for the  governor's appointee                                                               
for  commissioner  of the  Department  of  Commerce, Community  &                                                               
Economic Development.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
8:05:38 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JULIE  SANDE,  Appointee,  Commissioner Designee,  Department  of                                                               
Commerce,  Community &  Economic Development,  introduced herself                                                               
and  shared her  early life  experiences, including  working with                                                               
elders  at  the  Alaska  Pioneer Homes,  where  she  learned  the                                                               
importance of  having a vision  and being  a good neighbor.   She                                                               
stated  her education  and career  background, as  stated in  her                                                               
resume  [included  in  the committee  packet],  noting  that  her                                                               
career was primarily in the field  of health care.  She expressed                                                               
how  experience  in small,  private  business  ownership and  the                                                               
public  sector  had  shaped  her.     She  mentioned  large-scale                                                               
projects and  energy projects  in the state,  with which  she has                                                               
been involved,  including the  Alaska Industrial  Development and                                                               
Export Authority  (AIDEA) and the  Alaska Energy Authority.   She                                                               
added that  she is good  at multi-tasking, which she  has quickly                                                               
learned is necessary in her role as commissioner designee.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
8:10:49 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER  DESIGNEE  SANDE, in  response  to  a question  from                                                               
Representative McCabe about her  vision for the department, noted                                                               
that most businesses  in Alaska are small ones, and  she likes to                                                               
figure out ways to partner with  those in Alaska doing great work                                                               
and encouraging small businesses.   She recognized that there are                                                               
challenges  within  the  Department   of  Commerce,  Community  &                                                               
Economic Development  (DCCED), noting that one  project that will                                                               
be in the  forefront is the expansion of broadband.   In response                                                               
to a  follow-up question, she  responded that one of  the biggest                                                               
roadblocks will  be regulation, some  of the challenges  of which                                                               
stem from the  pandemic.  She explained that there  has been a 20                                                               
percent  increase in  issuance of  licenses,  while the  turnover                                                               
rate at  one point was  50 percent,  which makes it  difficult to                                                               
turn  out  work.    She  said she  sees  opportunities  there  to                                                               
incorporate some  shorter-term solutions to  address frustrations                                                               
and improve  customer service.   She  concluded that  [ensuring a                                                               
strong]  workforce is  one of  the primary  challenges she  faces                                                               
currently.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
8:14:34 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER  DESIGNEE  SANDE, in  response  to  a question  from                                                               
Representative Drummond  regarding Commissioner  Designee Sande's                                                               
time as administrator at the  Ketchikan Pioneer Home during a fee                                                               
increase,  said  that  increase was  heartbreaking,  because  she                                                               
cared about  the residents.  From  an administrative perspective,                                                               
the increase was overdue.  So,  although it did not feel good, it                                                               
was necessary.  She said the  Pioneer Homes are unique to Alaska,                                                               
and she  talked about the wisdom  of the residents.   In response                                                               
to a  follow-up question, she  recollected that one  resident had                                                               
to  move out  to  live  with her  daughter  [because  of the  fee                                                               
increase], but  none had to leave  Alaska.  She said  the Pioneer                                                               
Home does not ask anyone to leave.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:19:29 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER  DESIGNEE SANDE,  in  response to  a  second set  of                                                               
questions from  Representative Drummond regarding  the governor's                                                               
transfer  of  specialists  from  DCCED   to  the  Office  of  the                                                               
Governor,  said  she has  a  close  working relationship  with  a                                                               
couple  folks who  work  in the  Anchorage  office; the  economic                                                               
development  team in  the Office  of the  Governor works  closely                                                               
with  her office  to place  people with  the right  resources and                                                               
contacts in the state.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
8:21:44 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER  DESIGNEE SANDE,  in response  to a  query from  Co-                                                               
Chair Hannan, confirmed that she had  to give up her public seats                                                               
on AIDEA and  the Alaska Export Authority boards;  she moved over                                                               
to the seat designated for the commissioner on both boards.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
8:23:30 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER  DESIGNEE  SANDE,   in  response  to  Representative                                                               
McCarty,  discussed the  mission  of ensuring  a healthy  economy                                                               
while protecting consumers.  She  said the number one priority is                                                               
to have a  strong workforce, and that involves  getting people to                                                               
work faster  and generate  licenses faster.   She said  DCCED has                                                               
$1.8 billion  in its budget.   She talked about grant  funding in                                                               
play  to help  individuals and  businesses.   She also  mentioned                                                               
broadband and mariculture, tourism,  and grant funding as factors                                                               
in  moving the  economy forward.   To  a follow-up  question, she                                                               
noted  that  DCCED  works  closely   with  the  Alaska  Community                                                               
Foundation, and she talked about  the need for funding during the                                                               
pandemic  and  the  help  the  foundation  provided  in  ensuring                                                               
nonprofit agencies [seeking funding]  were reputable.  She talked                                                               
about determining  how each nonprofit  differs from the  other in                                                               
what it  offers and whether  they could  stand on their  own when                                                               
the grant  funding ends -  factors important in the  viability of                                                               
the organizations.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:30:06 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER  DESIGNEE  SANDE, in  response  to  a question  from                                                               
Representative  Patkotak  regarding  recruitment  and  retention,                                                               
noted  a wise  person  once  told her  that  the emphasis  always                                                               
should  be  on  retention  first, then  recruitment.    She  said                                                               
everyone  is experiencing  the crisis  in workforce  development.                                                               
She said the job cannot be done  without folks who can do the job                                                               
and want  to work.   She  said she is  asking managers  what they                                                               
need to  retain those on their  teams.  She said  she also thinks                                                               
there  are opportunities  to change  how the  state operates  its                                                               
system,  and she  is working  with  the Department  of Labor  and                                                               
Workforce Development (DLWD) on that  issue.  She suggested there                                                               
may be hiring  practices that are causing delays.   She mentioned                                                               
"the compact  bill" and reciprocity across  states for acceptance                                                               
of certain  licenses.   This would shorten  delays in  hiring and                                                               
the need for  new licensure.  She allowed that  this would not be                                                               
feasible for  all licenses, but for  many, it would.   She said a                                                               
statewide telework agreement would also be helpful.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
8:37:20 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER  DESIGNEE  SANDE  responded   to  a  question  about                                                               
affordable housing  and workforce development, which  she said go                                                               
hand in  hand.   She emphasized the  importance of  buying Alaska                                                               
products  and  hiring  people  from   Alaska  communities.    She                                                               
mentioned  apprenticeship programs.   She  said DCCED  will spend                                                               
time on  the broadband component of  [workforce development], and                                                               
it  is involved  in the  discussion with  rural Alaska  regarding                                                               
water and sewer pipe construction.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:39:23 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER DESIGNEE SANDE,  in response to a  question from Co-                                                               
Chair  Hannan  about  possible uses  for  retired  Alaska  Marine                                                               
Highway System  vessels, indicated  that when  she had  worked at                                                               
the Pioneer Home years ago  and there was consideration of having                                                               
to move residents out to  perform maintenance, she had considered                                                               
the unused ferry sitting offshore as temporary housing.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
8:43:03 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER  DESIGNEE  SANDE,   in  response  to  Representative                                                               
Drummond's remarks  about the lack  of a defined  benefit program                                                               
currently  in Alaska  and  the loss  of  teachers, observed  that                                                               
Alaska  is   in  a   workforce  crisis   she  had   never  before                                                               
encountered.   She  talked about  putting  aside differences  and                                                               
working  toward a  solution.   She said  the state  trains people                                                               
well and invests  in people, and the question is:   "Why do folks                                                               
move on?"   She spoke  about the  need for a  defined opportunity                                                               
for growth within departments.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
8:49:19 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER  DESIGNEE  SANDE, in  response  to  a question  from                                                               
Representative  McCabe   about  the  health  of   private  sector                                                               
businesses, expressed her appreciation  for those who are focused                                                               
on these  issues.   She said  she does not  know how  the private                                                               
sector will address [retention and  economic growth].  She talked                                                               
about supply chain issues and  loss of employees and the struggle                                                               
small  companies face  in that  regard, and  she pointed  out the                                                               
need  to determine  what small  companies can  offer that  larger                                                               
companies cannot.   She then  discussed the need  for flexibility                                                               
within  the state  to  be open  to allowing  some  of the  things                                                               
offered by the private sector, such as teleworking.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR SCHRAGE  echoed the  importance of  offering flexibility                                                               
and [substantial] wages and benefits in retaining employees.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER DESIGNEE SANDE, in  response to a follow-up question                                                               
from  Representative  McCabe,  said  she has  observed  that  the                                                               
legislature  supports doing  all it  can to  promote flexibility.                                                               
She mentioned workers being hired  from other communities to work                                                               
remotely.   She said  she will be  looking at  possible processes                                                               
that need to be put in place.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
8:56:12 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   DRUMMOND  pointed   out   that  private   sector                                                               
employers provide  social security; the  State of Alaska  has not                                                               
done  so since  it was  given  permission not  to do  so when  it                                                               
initiated a defined benefit system years ago.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
8:57:14 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER  DESIGNEE  SANDE,   in  response  to  Representative                                                               
McCarty's observation  that some employees  seem to have  a sense                                                               
of entitlement to  stay home to work, admitted that  she is "kind                                                               
of old  school," but she  envisions a  hybrid model.   She talked                                                               
about some positions  being more conducive to  telework while for                                                               
others, telework is not appropriate,  such as jobs that interface                                                               
frequently  with  the public.    She  talked about  acknowledging                                                               
where office space may no longer  be necessary in order to reduce                                                               
state  spending.   She talked  about the  public's perception  of                                                               
state  workers as  stewards of  the state  and the  importance of                                                               
"doing it right."                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
9:02:55 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER DESIGNEE  SANDE, in response to  remarks by Co-Chair                                                               
Hannan  regarding the  costs involved  in  allowing employees  to                                                               
work from home,  advised that this issue is one  in which she has                                                               
no involvement within DCCED.   Notwithstanding that, she said she                                                               
is confident  that other commissioners are  addressing the issue.                                                               
She mentioned broadband connection  again and the possibility for                                                               
connection for those who cannot  travel to larger communities but                                                               
have talents to share.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
9:06:35 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE DRUMMOND  commented about  the Atwood  Building in                                                               
Anchorage and the compacting of  modular units that resulted in a                                                               
savings to the state.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
9:08:24 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  SCHRAGE opened  public  testimony  on the  confirmation                                                               
hearing  for the  governor's appointee  for  commissioner of  the                                                               
Department of Commerce, Community  & Economic Development.  After                                                               
ascertaining there  was no one  who wished to testify,  he closed                                                               
public testimony.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  SCHRAGE thanked  Commissioner  Designee  Sande for  her                                                               
participation.  He said the  committee would take a brief at-ease                                                               
to sign  the confirmation  report [forwarding  the name  of Julie                                                               
Sande,  Appointee, Commissioner  Designee  to  the Department  of                                                               
Commerce, Community & Economic Development  to a joint session of                                                               
the  House and  Senate].   He reminded  the committee  that their                                                               
signatures on the report do not  reflect their intent to vote for                                                               
or against the confirmation during any further sessions.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:08:55 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
The committee took an at-ease from 9:09 a.m. to 9:12 a.m.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
         HB 309-APOC; CAMPAIGN CONTRIBUTIONS/REPORTING                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
9:12:06 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  SCHRAGE  announced that  the  final  order of  business                                                               
would be  HOUSE BILL  NO. 309, "An  Act exempting  candidates for                                                               
municipal office  and municipal office holders  in municipalities                                                               
with a  population of 15,000  or less from financial  or business                                                               
interest  reporting requirements;  relating  to campaign  finance                                                               
reporting  by  certain groups;  and  providing  for an  effective                                                               
date."  [Before  the committee, adopted as a  working document on                                                               
3/3/22, was  the proposed committee  substitute (CS) for  HB 309,                                                               
Version 32-LS0540\G, Bullard, 2/24/22 ("Version G").]                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
9:12:25 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
NILS  ANDREASSEN, Executive  Director,  Alaska Municipal  League,                                                               
stated that  the Alaska  Municipal League (AML)  has not  had the                                                               
opportunity to identify its position  in support of or opposition                                                               
to  the proposed  legislation.   He  spoke about  "the burden  of                                                               
participation"   finding folks to run  for local offices   and he                                                               
emphasized the importance of encouraging  participation.  He said                                                               
AML checked in with several  members of the legislature, who were                                                               
supportive of  HB 309 and  easing onerous requirements  [to apply                                                               
for elected  positions] while ensuring  adequate safeguards.   He                                                               
opined  this is  an important  issue and  HB 309  takes steps  to                                                               
improve the  system.   He said  AML would  take time  to consider                                                               
"what  else is  out there"  to improve  the election  process for                                                               
local officials.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:15:08 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR HANNAN noted that 136  governments in Alaska "have opted                                                               
out," and  HB 309  would potentially affect  25.   She questioned                                                               
why the  other smaller  communities are not  opting out  when the                                                               
majority  of local  governments have.   She  asked, "What  is the                                                               
struggle  to opting  out versus  changing statutes  so you  don't                                                               
have to comply?"                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. ANDREASSEN answered it could  be the limited capacity of some                                                               
of  these local  governments; they  may not  be aware  of current                                                               
statutes or  what steps they  can or  should take in  response to                                                               
statute.   He  speculated  that  so many  opting  out  may be  "a                                                               
symptom of the larger system that's  in place."  He suggested AML                                                               
and the state may have a  larger role in conveying the options to                                                               
those small governments.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR HANNAN asked whether AML  had heard from the Boroughs of                                                               
Ketchikan  Gateway,  Kodiak  Island,  North  Slope,  Wasilla,  or                                                               
Skagway.  She  said she is struggling to understand  the scope of                                                               
the  problem.   She  said  Alaska  has  a "deep  disclosure"  and                                                               
"Alaskans   have  gotten   used   to   having  that   information                                                               
available."    She said  she  can  understand  Edna Bay,  with  a                                                               
population  of 43,  as having  difficulty with  the requirements;                                                               
however,  she  noted Edna  Bay  already  does  not have  to  file                                                               
because of  [its low  population count].   She asked  whether AML                                                               
has heard from local governments "that they can't comply."                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR. ANDREASSEN answered no, but noted  that AML has not asked all                                                               
the communities.   He said  HB 309 would provide  the opportunity                                                               
for AML to "dig a little  bit deeper."  Those communities AML has                                                               
asked have  given feedback  that they "have  had issues  with how                                                               
things are currently  structured."  He said he could  get back to                                                               
Co-Chair  Hannan about  those  communities  she had  specifically                                                               
asked about.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
9:18:58 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE    JONATHAN     KRIESS-TOMKINS,    Alaska    State                                                               
Legislature, as  prime sponsor  of HB 309,  said one  question to                                                               
ask  is  whether  the  rule  makes sense  and  adds  value.    He                                                               
indicated it does  not make sense to require filing  for Edna Bay                                                               
City  Council  members when  the  population  there is  just  43.                                                               
Regarding  compliance, he  said he  had heard  from the  mayor of                                                               
Nome, Alaska, that it is "a pain  in the butt."  He said he would                                                               
not  be  surprised if  the  list  of  communities that  opts  out                                                               
continues to grow.  He  advised that many smaller communities can                                                               
be  saved the  time if  only  larger communities  fall under  the                                                               
requirement.   He said when  public officials are  managing "tens                                                               
of hundreds of millions of dollars,"  then it makes sense to have                                                               
that level of  transparency.  The intent is to  make it easier on                                                               
those in  smaller communities  where that is  not necessary.   He                                                               
speculated that  the Alaska Public Offices  Commission (APOC) has                                                               
spent time  "chasing down"  city council  members in  the smaller                                                               
communities to  fill out the  forms; so,  it is a  mutually time-                                                               
consuming process.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
9:22:02 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
HEATHER  HEBDON,   Executive  Director,  Alaska   Public  Offices                                                               
Commission, echoing the  comments of the bill  sponsor, said APOC                                                               
finds that  in the small  communities, council members  may serve                                                               
in  a volunteer  capacity,  and many  of them  come  and go,  not                                                               
serving a  full term.   She  said they have  to file  a financial                                                               
statement, an  annual statement, a  final statement, and  a cycle                                                               
of paperwork, and sometimes they  are holding these positions for                                                               
less than a three-year term.   Further, she noted that many don't                                                               
have an  office and struggle  with inconsistent mail  service and                                                               
limited connectivity [to  the Internet].  She said  the forms are                                                               
being filed with  the official's clerk, for example,  and APOC is                                                               
not  even   seeing  the  forms.     These  are   the  communities                                                               
disadvantaged by the penalties for  late filing, because the fees                                                               
for late filing are disproportionate  for small communities.  She                                                               
acknowledged  that the  North Slope  Borough  has money  "flowing                                                               
through" but  shares other disadvantages of  smaller communities,                                                               
such as issues with connectivity.   She concluded, "People aren't                                                               
requesting  copies of  these statements;  I don't  know that  ...                                                               
it's serving a public interest having to go through this."                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
9:25:09 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR HANNAN  pointed to a  [4-page] spreadsheet  [included in                                                               
the committee  packet, which lists those  municipalities that are                                                               
or  are not  subject to  a public  official financial  disclosure                                                               
(POFD)].   She asked for  confirmation that "the bottom  swath"                                                                 
municipalities with  populations less than 1,000,  including Edna                                                               
Bay - are exempt from filing a POFD.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MS.  HEBDON clarified  that candidates  of communities  listed in                                                               
the bottom swath  of the spreadsheet are not required  to file at                                                               
the time they submit their  candidate petition to run for office;                                                               
however, once elected, they are required to file.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  HANNAN noted  Skagway,  one of  the municipalities  she                                                               
represents, would  be exempted  under HB  309, and  she indicated                                                               
that Skagway  has not chosen  to adopt  an ordinance to  opt out.                                                               
She  asked Ms.  Hebdon to  note the  communities that  are "still                                                               
struggling with this"  in order to identify  where the population                                                               
break is.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
9:27:51 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEBDON posited that drawing "a  line in the sand" is a policy                                                               
call  for  the  legislature,  and  she  reiterated  her  previous                                                               
concerns  regarding the  smaller communities    especially  those                                                               
with  populations of  less than  1,000.   She remarked  that more                                                               
sophisticated municipalities  may be capable, but  she cannot say                                                               
they   meet  their   requirements   any   better,  because   many                                                               
municipalities with  populations of 1,500 down  to 1,000 continue                                                               
to  struggle.    She  noted  that  the  clerks'  offices  in  the                                                               
municipalities  are   the  record  holders,  and   they  need  to                                                               
communicate with APOC.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
9:29:23 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KREISS-TOMKINS added  that  it is  a question  of                                                               
what makes  sense in  terms of  a default  and whether  the state                                                               
should be putting  forward this mandate for  all communities when                                                               
there  has  been  minimal  interest, in  terms  of  [the  public]                                                               
inquiring about POFDs.   He talked about allowing  a community to                                                               
decide "what makes sense to them from a POFD basis."                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
9:30:41 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MCCARTY   offered  his  understanding   that  the                                                               
premise of  HB 309 is "to  have transparency of the  integrity of                                                               
candidates."   He talked  about how  in small  communities people                                                               
know the business of everyone.   He asked why "the 15,000 number"                                                               
is seen  as a problem.   He then asked  about the issues  of mail                                                               
delays and  whether viable candidates  are being  prohibited from                                                               
running for office.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE KREISS-TOMKINS responded that  the question of the                                                               
threshold is  a policy call.   Currently  the line is  1,000, and                                                               
under HB 309  it would be 15,000.   He said he  thinks the higher                                                               
number  makes  sense based  on  observations  from APOC  and  Mr.                                                               
Andreassen.  To the issue  of how candidates are being prohibited                                                               
from  running for  office, he  referred to  testimony heard  at a                                                               
previous meeting from  the mayor of the City of  Nome, as well as                                                               
written  testimony from  Mr. Walker  [included  in the  committee                                                               
packet].  The issue  is the hassle and time it  takes to file the                                                               
forms being a disincentive to running  for office.  He noted that                                                               
planning commissions fall under the requirement, as well.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
9:37:37 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  ANDREASSEN,  to  the  questions  from  Co-Chair  Hannan  and                                                               
Representative McCarty, advised that  it is important to remember                                                               
how diverse  the communities on  the spread  sheet are.   He said                                                               
population is  one factor.   Other factors include class  of city                                                               
or borough, total revenue  and responsibilities, geographic area,                                                               
and  diversity.     He  proffered   that  communities   have  not                                                               
identified this  as a challenge  because they follow the  law and                                                               
"prioritize  their  communications  to   the  legislature."    He                                                               
advised  that   the  more  that   is  added  to  the   number  of                                                               
requirements  of  municipalities,  the   more  reduced  is  their                                                               
ability  to  respond to  all  other  priorities.   He  asked  the                                                               
committee to  keep in mind  that the clerks responsible  for this                                                               
filing are  responsible for a  multitude of other tasks  in these                                                               
smaller municipalities.   He  advised that the  more that  can be                                                               
done  to reduce  their obligations,  the better.   He  encouraged                                                               
allowing  these smaller  municipalities  to focus  on the  things                                                               
that matter, such as public safety, education, and elections.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
9:41:32 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE  asked whether the City  of Fairbanks, with                                                               
a population of  31,668, would maintain its opt  out status under                                                               
HB 309.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE KREISS-TOMKINS  confirmed that  under HB  309, the                                                               
communities  that had  already  opted out  would  continue to  be                                                               
opted out.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE observed that  the threshold proposed under                                                               
HB 309  is targeted  to help smaller  areas where  everyone knows                                                               
his/her  neighbor.   He pointed  to  the Boroughs  of Kodiak  and                                                               
North  Slope as  two  that  would be  included  under the  15,000                                                               
threshold  but are  spread out.   He  suggested the  inclusion of                                                               
those boroughs may "change the  paradigm of what you're trying to                                                               
do with this bill."                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
9:44:32 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE KREISS-TOMKINS reflected that  that is an accurate                                                               
assessment, and he suggested the  threshold could be modified to,                                                               
for  example,  10,000  to  try to  capture  the  larger  boroughs                                                               
mentioned by Representative McCabe.   He said he would not oppose                                                               
an amendment to that effect.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
9:45:27 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE PATKOTAK noted that he  had served on the assembly                                                               
of the North  Slope Borough, and he had not  realized the borough                                                               
was  "potentially  exempted  from  it."    Regarding  boards  and                                                               
commissions,  he  noted some  assembly  members  dealt with  geo-                                                               
bonding and  investment committee  members dealt with  the Alaska                                                               
permanent fund    both dealing with  large amounts of money.   He                                                               
said for those types of  boards and commissions, he thinks having                                                               
a  disclosure requirement  in place  is diligent.   On  the other                                                               
hand, the Inupiat [Heritage] Center  boards and commissions dealt                                                               
with "things  that are  less financial in  nature," and  he could                                                               
see  where the  filing requirement  for such  an entity  would be                                                               
cumbersome.   He  offered his  understanding that  under HB  309,                                                               
those municipalities  under 15,000 would have  the opportunity to                                                               
opt in,  and he asked whether  there could be a  choice to select                                                               
which boards and commissions to opt in on.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KREISS-TOMKINS  responded  that  he  thinks  that                                                               
opportunity  would exist  in  that each  borough  would have  the                                                               
prerogative "to make those calls."                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE PATKOTAK,  based on  that response, said  he would                                                               
be more comfortable with the  15,000 threshold currently proposed                                                               
under HB 309.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
9:50:10 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  HANNAN noted  that Mr.  Andreassen had  referenced that                                                               
perhaps  it  is  "not  just   the  population  threshold."    She                                                               
questioned whether the  bill sponsor had considered  the style of                                                               
government.    She  mentioned those  who  volunteer  with  zoning                                                               
commissions  and the  conflict  that  can come  from  that.   She                                                               
further  mentioned the  powers of  property  taxation and  police                                                               
powers  and  said  she  thinks "there's  some  assurance  to  the                                                               
community that their  government is working on  their behalf, not                                                               
on  a personal  self-interest."   She stated  she has  no problem                                                               
exempting communities under 1,000, but  15,000 is "way too high."                                                               
She posited  that the  consideration is  not just  population but                                                               
the  type and  structure of  government, and  she asked  the bill                                                               
sponsor whether he had considered this.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE KREISS-TOMKINS  answered, "I  can't say  we have."                                                               
He said  it makes  sense to  give each  community the  ability to                                                               
decide  what   it  wants  and  eliminate   the  state's  "blanket                                                               
mandate."  Given  feedback and information available,  he said he                                                               
would  hesitate  "to  start  breaking   out  different  types  of                                                               
governments against others when it  seems like, more or less, the                                                               
reality's been the same across all types of governments."                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
9:54:28 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
The committee took an at-ease from 9:54 a.m. to 9:55 a.m.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
9:55:28 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MCCARTY suggested the  question is whether APOC is                                                               
the sole  source for collecting information  related to integrity                                                               
and  transparency.   He reflected  that quite  a few  communities                                                               
have opted  out, thus taking  that burden off  APOC.  He  said he                                                               
has not heard  during any testimony that the opting  out has been                                                               
a problem.   He said  he is "good  with the 15,000"  and "keeping                                                               
the integrity of this."                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
9:57:51 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE  said he would  not offer the  amendment he                                                               
had prepared.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
9:58:00 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR HANNAN moved to adopt Amendment  1 to HB 309, Version G,                                                               
labeled 32-LS0540\I.1, Bullard, 3/8/22, which read as follows:                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, line 2:                                                                                                            
          Delete "15,000"                                                                                                     
          Insert "3,000"                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2, line 31:                                                                                                           
          Delete "15,000"                                                                                                       
          Insert "3,000 [15,000]"                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     Page 4, line 17:                                                                                                           
          Delete "15,000"                                                                                                       
          Insert "3,000"                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Page 4, line 27:                                                                                                           
          Delete "15,000"                                                                                                   
          Insert "3,000"                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 5, line 12:                                                                                                           
          Delete "15,000"                                                                                                   
          Insert "3,000"                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 6, line 6:                                                                                                            
          Delete "15,000"                                                                                                   
     Insert "3,000"                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
9:58:03 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR SCHRAGE objected for the purpose of discussion.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR HANNAN  spoke to Amendment  1, which she noted  had been                                                               
the one she anticipated Representative  McCabe would have offered                                                               
but did not.   She said the threshold would  be dropped to 3,000.                                                               
She reiterated  that she understands  the burden to  the smallest                                                               
of  communities.     She  pointed   out  that  many  of   the  35                                                               
municipalities  that   would  be   included  under  HB   309  are                                                               
functional  first-class cities  and  boroughs, and  she does  not                                                               
think they should be exempt.   Changing the number to 3,000 would                                                               
include  the City  of  Skagway.   She  reiterated  that a  larger                                                               
number is  too high.   She emphasized that  she does not  want to                                                               
take the  public disclosure information  out of the record.   She                                                               
noted  that  Amendment 1  had  been  drafted  to align  with  the                                                               
original  bill  version,  so  the  line  numbering  needs  to  be                                                               
corrected for Version G.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR SCHRAGE said if Amendment  1 were to pass, the committee                                                               
would give Legislative  Legal Services the authority  to make any                                                               
conforming changes.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
10:00:33 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  PATKOTAK  said  he   would  be  more  attuned  to                                                               
supporting  an  amendment  with  the  hybrid  idea  he  suggested                                                               
previously.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
10:00:52 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR SCHRAGE maintained his objection.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
10:00:54 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
A roll call vote was  taken.  Representatives Drummond and Hannan                                                               
voted in  favor of  the motion  to adopt Amendment  1 to  HB 309,                                                               
Version  G.    Representatives  McCarty,  McCabe,  Patkotak,  and                                                               
Schrage voted  against it.   Therefore, Amendment 1 failed  to be                                                               
adopted by a vote of 2-4.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
10:01:49 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR HANNAN  moved to report  CSHB 309,  Version 32-LS0540\G,                                                               
Bullard,    2/24/22,   out    of   committee    with   individual                                                               
recommendations and  the accompanying fiscal notes.   There being                                                               
no  objection,  CSHB  309(CRA)  was reported  out  of  the  House                                                               
Community and Regional Affairs Standing Committee.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
10:02:51 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
There being no  further business before the  committee, the House                                                               
Community  and Regional  Affairs Standing  Committee meeting  was                                                               
adjourned at 10:03 a.m.                                                                                                         

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
Julie Sande Resume 2022.Redacted.pdf HCRA 3/10/2022 8:00:00 AM
Spreadsheet Explanation for HB 309.pdf HCRA 3/10/2022 8:00:00 AM
HB 309
HB 309 Updated Spreadsheets.pdf HCRA 3/10/2022 8:00:00 AM
HB 309
HB 309 Am 1.pdf HCRA 3/10/2022 8:00:00 AM
HB 309